Shministim: Why We Refuse

I found it very disappointing that the girls were only allowed to speak for what must have been less than 10 minutes.
It almost felt like they were on display.
I hope tonights program is structured differently.

So, Zionist occupiers of Palestinian lands refuse to help other Zionists occupy other Palestinian lands.

That would be like Oscar Schindler refusing to help other NAZIs steal other Polish lands after he already got his piece of Poland.

Looks like the Zionists who are feasting off the misery of the vanquished Palestinians are too busy feasting off the misery of Palestinians to be bothered with helping other Zionists feast off the misery of even more Palestinians.

The ability of citizens (and citizenship is not usually chosen, but imposed) to dissent against the government that rules the place where they were born is important to recognize, celebrate, and extend. The more Israelis who refuse to go along with the domestic and territorial and foreign military policies of the Israeli state, the less the Zionist Entity will enjoy legitimacy, both internally and externally. Isn't that a good thing? The more Americans who protest and dissent against the US's foreign adventures, the less those US policies have legitimacy. Or are all Americans irredeemably complicit in the genocide of American Indians, the chattel slavery of Africans, the internment of Japanese, etc? The only good American is a dead one?

So there's something irredeemable about "Zionists" (why don't you fess up and admit that this is your -- and others' -- code/swear word for Jews), that makes them forever tainted by the policies of the government that rules the place where they were born... Sounds familiar. The only good Zionist is a dead one, right? Fuck you and your antisemitic bullshit.

yeah - what is Prion talking about. People of any ethnicity should be able to both stay where they are, or to apply to move to another area and rent or buy an apartment. There is no reason why jewish people shouldn't be able to move somewhere, and there was no reason why arabs and other palestinians also shouldn't be able to live somewhere.

If Prion is arguing for one race, ethnicity per state, then chances are he or she should get off the continent.

The only one who wrote about Zionists was me, so I will assume your comment was directed at me. And NO, Zionists are Jews, but so are Palestinian Jews who did NOT chose to be murderous thieves of Palestinian lands.
There happens to be a world of differance between Jews who ARE occupying the Palestinian's homeland and Jews who are NOT occupying anyone else's homeland.

You wrote that the 2 women, and other Zionists occupying the Palestinian's homeland, were born in Zionist occupied Palestine. Twice. As if that means something to you.

And the Zionist crusader state is Zionist occupied Palestinian lands so the Zionist crusader state has NO legitimacy to loose.

As for .'s suggestion that Zionist occupation of Palestine gives Zionists a right to continue occupying Palestinian lands, well that suposition is just too void of any substance. Zionist occupation of Palestinian lands is a reason to liberate Palestine from the ZIonist occupiers; and NOT a reason to appease the Zionist's bloodsoaked occupation of Palestinian lands.

Many Palestinians are prevented form moving to where they want, even their own land, because Zionist crusaders are occupying that land. Zionist occupation of Palestinian lands is a state of war which denies the Palestinians their fundamental right of self determination.

I am not arguing for one ethnicity race per state. I juast respect the palestinian's basic human right NOT to be destroyed to ANY extent by ZIonist invadors. The reason Zionists have no right to live in Palestinian lands is because Zionists have no birthright of murderous theft of ANY Palestinian lands.

The comment from "PrionParty" is out of line. These Israeli teenagers are making an informed decision at an early age based upon limited options. They are refusing to participate in the military domination by the IDF against the Palestinians. For this they deserve the support of pro-Palestinian activists and should not be attacked and grouped with other Zionists!!

When anyone is born into an occupier nation's population they are handed a set of cards that they need to play. They cannot return the cards to the dealer and ask for another hand, they are forced to play the hand they are dealt as best they can. In this case the choice to refuse military service in the IDF is commendable and not without some social retribution from their families, the community and greater Israeli society..

In another example, if i could have the cards of my choice i would be born in north america 100 years prior to the arrival of Columbus. Then i would not have to participate in any way in the exploitation and colonization of the indigenous peoples of the americas, because i would be one of them and Christobal Columbus would not yet be born, so we could enjoy our natural ecosystem before all the destruction caused by colonialism..

However, that is not the case and i was dealt the cards that make me a child of European immigrants 500 years after colonization of the americas by Europeans and their imported African slaves. Clearly this sets up a moral dilema, though i try to play my hand the best by advocating for greater rights for indigenous peoples and protections for our shared ecosystem..

Teenagers born in Israel today likewise had no options about the Balfour Declaration or the original Zionist platforms are written by Theodore Herzl. Being a refusnik and peace activist while living in Israel helps the Palestinians moreso than running away from their place of birth and otherwise ignoring the problem, or living as a Zionist (Jew or Christian) in the U.S. safe from the bombs yet advocating greater funding for the IDF as AIPAC and CUFI (Christian Zionists) often do..

By the way, at the time of much of the immigration, there were zero countries in the world which were legally accepting jewish refugees trying to escape Poland. Look it up. If they were to have followed border laws at the time, the international laws at the time collectively would sentence them to death.

Many were illegally fleeing into any place they could get to. While the true cause of the problem was several murderous governments, the failure of international refugee regulations or border laws gave them the ethical grounds to go wherever they wanted.
This is different from the concept of driving anyone else off of their land, or later waves of ethnicity based immigration preferences.
A very similar argument arises when policies imposed by CAFTA/NAFTA/WTO make Central America or Mexico desperately poor, and many people want to cross borders in order to make any money so that their family doesn't starve or lack funds to see a doctor.

Someone called 'c' wrote;

"This is different from the concept of driving anyone else off of their land, or later waves of ethnicity based immigration preferences."

No, this isn't an excuse for the current actions of the Israeli government either. The previous comment i defended the refusenik dissenters because they were teenagers and somebody called "PrionParty" was making hostile statements for them. My point was that as teenagers they were making the best possible choice given the circumstances, though that is not any sort of an excuse for the circumstances (Zionist Israel's apartheid and illegal occupation of Palestinian lands) either.

Often time when discussing Zionist Israel's policies in public settings we need to clarify and reclarify our positions because Zionist propagandists are skilled agents of distortion. So a comment defending the actions of some refusnik teenagers suddenly can morph into a blanket support statement for the Israeli government when that is not the case!!

Now on another more personal subject we have an ongoing FBI investigation into an alleged al Queda terror plot on public transit. As a rider of public transit unable to afford or lacking the desire to own a vehicle, this effects me personally. Not only that, as a migratory houseless person i frequently carry a large backpack onto transit and will now have to face stares, fear and possible police searches for simply moving around the country in the most effecient and environmentally friendly way that i am able to..

Without straying into tangents, we can directly trace the motives for the existence of al Queda to the ongoing apartheid policies practiced by Zionist Israel's government AND the U.S. military bases, wars and embargos against Muslim nations (often tied into pro-Zionist policies)..

We cannot make excuses for current Israeli actions against occupied Palestinians based upon actions taken by Hitler and Nazi governments in Europe decades ago. If we want to get into historical data, let's get some more info on Nazi collaboration with Zionists, preventing Jews from leaving Europe UNLESS they went to Israel. IF no other country accepted Jews is true (thought that Britain accepted some Jewish refugees from the Nazi Holocaust, at least temporarily), than this supports the statement that in order to fulfill the goals of Zionists attempting to populate Israel needed to have a reason for mass exodus of Jews from Europe, effectively funneling them into Israel at the expense of the Palestinians. Then the victors, U.S. and Britain escalated the process of putting as many Jews into Israel as possible, despite their knowledge that Palestinians were already there and were being adversely effected by the influx of Jewish refugees..

Two wrongs STILL do NOT make a right, and they never will. We cannot make excuses for present day Israel's treatment of Palestinians based upon past crimes committed against the Jews of Europe. Same goes for al Queda blowing up innocent people ANYWHERE, whether at the WTC or a U.S. embassy in Africa or a Madrid subway. Since we lack proof of any current wrongs in the U.S. transit bomber we cannot rush into any convictions, though in all honestly OBL never lied about his future intents and if not these folks being investigated in Colorado it would be someone else eventually.

My personal choice for future al Queda attacks would be for other targets besides public transit, especially some of the dams that need to be removed from our rivers. If al Queda chose this sort of target instead, no human civilian casualites (we the people of U.S. really did lose control of our pro-Zionist government's actions, it's really not our fault!!) and an improved riparian environment would be the result, plus a good sized gaggle of environmentalists who would be possible supporters of al Queda in the future, effectively making them folk heroes way out west. An al Queda strategist should pick up on this and consider possible recruitment options. What good is blowing up the train (or bus, or subway) and killing possible future al Queda ops in the process? Why not use public transit as possible recruitment centers instead of blowing them up? There's plenty of U.S. residents riding the train who have plenty of gripes with the U.S. government and may help out with some low level projects provided no humans get hurt and only infrastructure is targeted? Terrorism out west follows the ELF and ALF credos of "harm none", focusing attacks only on non-living objects. We would ask al Queda ops in the future to honor this simple request and they may gain some potential allies..

That being said, the people on the frontlines know that the most effective way to stop al Queda and end the bloodshed of terrorism is to stop engaging in behavior against Muslim nations that provoke hostility to begin with..

In other words stop pouring kerosene (military occupations, airborne bombers, trade embargos, financial and propaganda support of Zionist Israel, etc..) onto the fire and reach for some water (use dimplomacy, close down U.S. military bases in Muslim lands, stop AIPAC and CUFI influence on U.S. politicians that causes them to be biased in supporting Zionist Israel, stop interfereing in Muslims nations, etc...) instead..

In the meanwhile my recommendation to future al Queda ops is the lower four Klamath dams on the Klamath River, we're waiting for government actions for legal removal, though the salmon may not be able to wait!!

Accomplish this difficult yet important goal then Allah and the salmon will reward you in Heaven. Salmon buffet for all eternity (just kidding!!)..