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Freshwater update
more tree sitter extractios, trees cut, non-violent protesters arrested
On the morning of Thursday, April 17 Pacific Lumber hired climbers to forceably remove another tree sitter from the lower tree sit village of the Freshwater watershed in Freshwater, California. The sitter, dubbed 'Nudie', was removed, lowered to the ground, arrested and transported to the Humboldt County Correctional Facility. Within minutes of Nudie's arrest Pacific Lumber employees cut down the tree Nudie had been defending. The tree, and 800 year old redwood named Poseidon, thundered to the ground, shattering it's top upon impact. As the the tree was being cut, a group of non-violent protesters stopped a passing logging truck, loaded with three huge tree trunks. One of the protesters crawled underneath the truck and 'locked down' to the front axle, slowing traffic on the road to a crawl for over an hour. Sherrif's deputies arrived on the scene. The protester was eventually arrested. The Lower Village of the Freshwater tree sits has been severely cut in the past month, little of it remains, and what is still standing is hardly recognizable. The tree that was fallen today was about ten feet from the public road, on a steep slope. There is a concern that now that the tree is dead it's roots will rot. The strong and deep root base of the trees linning the road provide support for the concrete. If the roots do indeed rot we can expect to see the road wash out in the rainsover the next five to ten years. Today's events were a continuation of Maxxam Corporation's (the owner of the Pacific Lumber Company) liquidation logging practices here in Humboldt County. As we stand and watch trees fall and habitat be destroyed we must RISE UP! in defense of our Mother Earth. Please send your blessings and prayers to the trees.
May the forest be with you.
May the forest be with you.
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Redwood roots do not die off like other tree species. The roots may undergo a slight die back, but as sprouts take hold, they continue growth. Your concerns are unfounded.
In fact, there was likely a greater chance for instablitity with the trees standing. The canopies form sails that catch wind and can result in the entire tree (stump and all) being ripped from the ground. That can lead to considerable erosion problems.
If you research some of your concerns before you voice them, you may come across as more informed and thus a more reliable voice of forest activism.
In fact, there was likely a greater chance for instablitity with the trees standing. The canopies form sails that catch wind and can result in the entire tree (stump and all) being ripped from the ground. That can lead to considerable erosion problems.
If you research some of your concerns before you voice them, you may come across as more informed and thus a more reliable voice of forest activism.
Not only is gypsymoth right on the money with his facts, but how about this newsflash; PL plants a minimum of ONE MILLION trees, that's 1,000,000 trees, that's one hundred times ten thousand trees each and every year during the winter. That's a minimum. I suggest that instead of sending your prayers and blessings to the trees, you may want to send a hoe-dad into your own idealistic hands and plant a few hundred yourself. Find out what real, hard, 10 hour a day, six day a week work is really all about before you criticize people who work like dogs for a wage and a career that they enjoy.
Oh, and your definition of a steep slope must be skewed or else a california licensed geologist wouldn't have surveyed this slope and said, "no problem here, continue operations." Hhhhmmmm. I smell a rat. Now who do you think know more about soils and steep slopes? That's right, it has to be your arrogant ametuer ass.
Oh, and your definition of a steep slope must be skewed or else a california licensed geologist wouldn't have surveyed this slope and said, "no problem here, continue operations." Hhhhmmmm. I smell a rat. Now who do you think know more about soils and steep slopes? That's right, it has to be your arrogant ametuer ass.
dogs is the word for it, but more like lap dogs, lap dogs for the rich who already have too much money, but have to have more because of their compulsive greed....of course "sinner" hates anybody who has some impulse to resist--slaves always hate those who are free--personally i'd rather be dead than be one of these brutal/ignorant/selfdestructive lumps...animals is what they are, and animals is what they gonna stay...the only question is whether the rich and corrupt will be successful at using them as attack dogs--why don't somebody sign civil and criminal charges on this 'eric shatz' bitch? Pig, i mean.
To trust Maxxam hired geologists or "biostitutes" to determine that thousands of acres of clear cuts will result in "no significant impact" to the watersheds is to sacrifice your mind to corporate drivel. Clear cutting on steep and unstable slopes, like those that comprise Freshwater Watershed, causes landslides, the siltation of the creeks and the destruction of neighboring properties.
To trust CDF or any other bought off agency with the health and care of the public trust is to drink water laden with herbicides and wade in the mud that fills your living room.
To trust CDF or any other bought off agency with the health and care of the public trust is to drink water laden with herbicides and wade in the mud that fills your living room.
Dogboy, hate is such a strong word; one which I can't subscribe. Contempt for those that won't solve a problem legally or constructively, disdain for others who can't even define 'steep slope', and scorn for those who claim to have open minds, yet cannot admit the merits of what is already accomplished - yes. Jeez, talk about the pot calling the kettle black.
Dave, I believe you were searching for geostitute, for a biostitute don't do soils, bro. Bought off? Do you honestly think that any college educated, state accredited geologist would do their analysis for free? Of course they are paid as employees or contractors by a timber company that is forced by contract to conduct steep slope surveys on every single THP. Don't you accept pay for your job? Then, according to you, all bread winners are *stitutes. So the people who do it for free, are they just sluts?
Dave, I believe you were searching for geostitute, for a biostitute don't do soils, bro. Bought off? Do you honestly think that any college educated, state accredited geologist would do their analysis for free? Of course they are paid as employees or contractors by a timber company that is forced by contract to conduct steep slope surveys on every single THP. Don't you accept pay for your job? Then, according to you, all bread winners are *stitutes. So the people who do it for free, are they just sluts?
Such negativity brought out by one individuals statement on what they saw as happening in Freshwater. This problem obviusly goes deeper than quibbles over terminology and one's perception of a steep, unstable slope. Let's move past the name calling. What is occuring in Freshwater right now is an emergency. The destruction of that watershed is going to have a huge impact on all of us in the community. Loggers and activists alike. And regardless on one's position on MAXXAM's logging practices, there is no arguing that the tree sitter extractions that have occurred there over the past month have been highly dangerous to all parties envolved. The way that the Pacific Lumber Company has handled the situation has been shady at best, illegal at times, and highly innapproriate.
MAXXAM out of Humboldt.
Eric Schatz out of Humboldt.
RISE UP and RESIST!!!!!!!!!
MAXXAM out of Humboldt.
Eric Schatz out of Humboldt.
RISE UP and RESIST!!!!!!!!!
The concept of right and wrong is a matter of moral opinion. Often times, the creation of laws as a result of the manifestation of such morals leads to the displacement and rejection of those people with adverse moral positions. While some may feel this legal system is inherently biased because of this fact, it does not allow the system to be all out rejected for its shortcomings. The legal system we have is not perfect, but that shouldn't nullify its authority.
That being said, the only known fact about the legallity of treesitting is that those engaged in treesits are trespassing. This makes every tree sit illegal. Not wrong or right, just illegal.
The actions taken to extract the sitters are done under a court order. The county of Humboldt is responsible for removing the protesters. While the methods utilized to perform the extractions are both heart stopping and unsightly, their legallity is certainly less in question than that of the sitters invovled.
Finally, please place some of the responsibilty for safety on the sitters and their supporters. They choose to put themselves in harms way and are accepting the risks. Mr. Schatz is not the problem. If you really beleive that, you should take a better look at the issue.
meow
That being said, the only known fact about the legallity of treesitting is that those engaged in treesits are trespassing. This makes every tree sit illegal. Not wrong or right, just illegal.
The actions taken to extract the sitters are done under a court order. The county of Humboldt is responsible for removing the protesters. While the methods utilized to perform the extractions are both heart stopping and unsightly, their legallity is certainly less in question than that of the sitters invovled.
Finally, please place some of the responsibilty for safety on the sitters and their supporters. They choose to put themselves in harms way and are accepting the risks. Mr. Schatz is not the problem. If you really beleive that, you should take a better look at the issue.
meow
If anyone should know anything about illegality, it is Maxxam/PL, as they are the county kings of breaking laws. If they could abide by both human and natural laws when carrying out timber operations, they wouldn't be faced with all the tree-sits and other protests.
Nowhere in any court order does it say the tree-sitters should be removed by force. The decisions and orders to extract come from the corporation. The corporation, in cahoots with Eric Schatz, dictates the methods used.
When it comes to safety, all of us are in jeopardy if we live in Humboldt, especially in Freshwater or Elk River Watershed. If the entire community were not under siege by Maxxam and its cut-and-run agenda, there would be no need to try to get in the way of their dangerous, unsustainable logging.
Roar.
Nowhere in any court order does it say the tree-sitters should be removed by force. The decisions and orders to extract come from the corporation. The corporation, in cahoots with Eric Schatz, dictates the methods used.
When it comes to safety, all of us are in jeopardy if we live in Humboldt, especially in Freshwater or Elk River Watershed. If the entire community were not under siege by Maxxam and its cut-and-run agenda, there would be no need to try to get in the way of their dangerous, unsustainable logging.
Roar.
Human Rights Watch reported in January that an 18-year-old Christian woman from western Sudan had been convicted of adultery and sentenced to death by stoning. The man she was accused of having sex with was not tried due to lack of evidence. The men who will stone her to death have the legal responsibility to uphold the law by throwing stones at her until she is dead. Does that make the law reasonable and just? Does that remove all personal responsibility from the men involved? Is the state in the right in acting to uphold this law?
Are there ever instances in which the law is incorrect, and needs amending?
Are there ever instances in which the law is incorrect, and needs amending?
"However, the subordinate obeying an order is liable to punishment, if it was known to him that the order of the superior involved the infringement of civil or military law... It is certainly to be urged in favour of the military subordinates that they are under no obligation to question the order of their superior officer, and they can count upon its legality. But no such confidence can be held to exist, if such an order is universally known to everybody, including the accused, to be without any doubt whatever against the law."
In this case the forest defenders can be seen to be acting to invoke an emergency injunction against the illegal and immoral actions of the corporation, Maxxam/PL. Those who act in opposition to the tree sitters will be personally liable for their actions, especially where such actions constitute a physical threat to the health and well-being of the forest defenders.
In this case the forest defenders can be seen to be acting to invoke an emergency injunction against the illegal and immoral actions of the corporation, Maxxam/PL. Those who act in opposition to the tree sitters will be personally liable for their actions, especially where such actions constitute a physical threat to the health and well-being of the forest defenders.
We can wish that our governments weren’t pursuing their political ends through violent means. We can desire leadership that builds connection with other peoples rather than division. We can hope for a culture that doesn’t devour its natural resources like there’s no tomorrow. But what are we willing to do in our personal lives to help create such a society? Will we take the radical responsibility for everything that comes our way including our culture as it now exists? Because, whether we want to admit it or not, through our actions (and our inaction) we have helped to create it.
I'd like to get involved stopping these rapists. Email me, Radha. Thanks.
There's a common theme in a lot of the postings by the "forest defenders" and their supporters. I'm thinking of postings by Dave, Carl, and Concerned Citizen in particular. Its essence is, "I know The Truth, therefore anything contrary to my beliefs is corrupt." Scientist says that the slope underneath my favorite tree is stable? Well, that scientist has to be a corrupt Blue Meanie! Property law doesn't support my position? Well, those laws are wrong because they exist solely for the purpose of aiding the Blue Meanies! Court Order says the tree sitters should come down? That's OK, but anybody who enforces it is a Blue Meanie! It's a cop-out into cult thinking.
Short of the timber industry capitulating to the whims of their opposition, I am having difficulty conceiving of another method of removing protesters in the trees. I haven't heard many other options being shopped around. The methods currently being used, corporate sponsored or not, are both fuctional and designed to limit the threat to human safety. The end result is another matter.
I would prefer that these extractions would not be necessary. The thought of any injury or death in the woods saddens me greatly. So if anyone out there has any better, safer methods of extraction, by all means voice your thoughts.
If there is no other option to remove the folks in the trees, then examine whether you really blame the climbers, or if you are just angry because they are doing a good job at safely removing the protesters.
meow
I would prefer that these extractions would not be necessary. The thought of any injury or death in the woods saddens me greatly. So if anyone out there has any better, safer methods of extraction, by all means voice your thoughts.
If there is no other option to remove the folks in the trees, then examine whether you really blame the climbers, or if you are just angry because they are doing a good job at safely removing the protesters.
meow
gorg, tak, thorg. .30-06. grunt, grunt, heavy breathing.
The "cop-out" of the cult of modern society is to stop thinking. Those who are compassionate, rational, well-informed, and have a viewpoint which includes the historical as well as the present-day are our best hope for the future.
Just because several thoughtful people have arrived at a conclusion different from your own, doesn't mean you can categorize them as having joined a cult. Perhaps you would like to believe that the whole world is divided into two cults--yours, and everyone who isn't part of yours.
But in truth, it's much more complicated than that. For instance, across America, you would probably find that most Americans would prefer that ancient trees and forests be preserved, and yet these people would represent many different faiths, races, and backgrounds.
Most Americans want clean water and safe food for themselves and their children. Is that a cult? Most of us want to be free from the threat of violence. What kind of cult do you name that? There are many issues related to quality of life we can (almost) all agree on, and no one has to call it a "cop-out" or a "cult."
Just because several thoughtful people have arrived at a conclusion different from your own, doesn't mean you can categorize them as having joined a cult. Perhaps you would like to believe that the whole world is divided into two cults--yours, and everyone who isn't part of yours.
But in truth, it's much more complicated than that. For instance, across America, you would probably find that most Americans would prefer that ancient trees and forests be preserved, and yet these people would represent many different faiths, races, and backgrounds.
Most Americans want clean water and safe food for themselves and their children. Is that a cult? Most of us want to be free from the threat of violence. What kind of cult do you name that? There are many issues related to quality of life we can (almost) all agree on, and no one has to call it a "cop-out" or a "cult."
I love trees, you can cut them down and make useful things out of them.
If you really want to come get me I'm currently stationed at Fort Knox.
Who the hell are you talking too?
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