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Trapped Like Mice: Palestinians under the New Israeli "Disengagement Plan"
Palestine has been in the headlines of the Western mainstream media again. The preparations leading up to the elections on January 9 have given everyone enough news to cover — or rather: they have given the media enough news to cover up what is actually developing on the ground. But it is this current situation on the ground that will, if it is not stopped in time, more effectively shape the future for the Palestinian people than any electoral process ever could.
Away from international attention, the destiny being prepared for the Palestinian people is showing its true face more clearly than ever before in the new Israeli plans presented to the public in the past few months. The Apartheid Wall, with its horrendous effects on Palestinian life and land, does not stand alone, but is today merging with the longstanding Israeli settlement policy and the creation of Jewish-only infrastructure into a comprehensive scheme for colonial domination and conquest.
An appalling plan for Palestine is shaping up behind Israeli slogans of "disengagement"; behind the British initiative to revive "the Road Map"; and behind the U.S. drive to force through the completion of Israeli plans that finalize the Bantustanization of the Palestinian people. All three are combining to push for an end to all Palestinian resistance, which is seen as a pre-condition for controlling the Middle East from Jerusalem to Baghdad. The U.S. administration in particular is highly aware that any possible chance of success for the occupation of Iraq, and for U.S.-Israeli plans to shape the future of the Greater Middle East, depend on their ability to create "stability" for the Israeli colonial project of annexation, expulsion, and occupation in Palestine.
Among the recent plans announced by Israel, some were mere masquerades for the international media, while others revealed concrete Israeli projects. The latest modification to the path of the Apartheid Wall was a plan of the first kind. These supposed modifications were nothing more than the result of U.S. and international pressure demanding maps that would enable them to defend the Wall in front of their constituencies and public opinion. The "new map" of the Wall represents a contorted game of numbers and definitions that has "lowered" the percentage of West Bank land stolen and destroyed by the Apartheid Wall to 6.1 percent.
But of course, as the media and political leaders praising the "new" plan inevitably fail to point out, this 6.1 percent needs to be added to the 11.8 percent annexed by the settlements and the 29.1 percent isolated in the Jordan Valley. Without even taking into account the additional land that has also been stolen from the Palestinian people for the construction of the settlers-only roads, this makes a total of 47 percent of the West Bank, and reveals itself as absolutely no different from the 47 percent that Israel intended to annex before the supposed modifications.
This game of numbers is also aimed at re-directing the way that the situation on the ground is talked about. It steers attention towards the size of the Bantustans being forced upon the Palestinian people, as if it was not the very fact that our people are being closed off behind walls that should create the outrage, rather than the question of whether these ghettos should be slightly larger. We are not fighting for bigger ghettos or for more colorful walls, but for liberation and justice in our land.
The real Israeli political project, meanwhile, can be found in the "disengagement plan" and the initiatives connected to this plan. The disengagement plan, far from being a withdrawal or giving the Palestinian people the right to statehood, demarcates in fact the full Bantustanization of our people. The rhetoric of the plan hides one of the best-elaborated and most effectively planned projects for the enslavement and destruction of an entire people.
This plan consists of four main construction projects that have been submitted to the public and are intimately linked to the construction of the Apartheid Wall:
1. The Building of New Settlements and the Expansion of Existing Settlements
Settlements have always been at the core of the colonial project to control Palestine. The so-called "disengagement plan" claims to be about the dismantling of settlements: that is, the evacuation of settlements in the Gaza Strip and of four minor settlements in the West Bank near Jenin. But at the same time, Israel has announced the annexation of all the other approximately 200 settlements in the Occupied West Bank and Jerusalem. In addition, Israel is currently expanding and constructing new settlements in the Tulkarem and Qalqiliya areas, ensuring the permanent annexation of the Palestinian lands isolated by the Wall.
2. More Settlers-Only "By-Pass" Roads
These fenced bypass roads, heavily guarded by the Israeli military, are for settlers only — Palestinians are not allowed to use or cross them. These roads cut through the West Bank and destroy the Palestinian road system, allowing the settlers free access everywhere while at the same time annexing lands and isolating Palestinian communities from each other in the same way the Apartheid Wall does. Israel has announced the construction of a further 500 km of roads to reinforce this apartheid road network. This will ensure that Palestinian residential areas are nothing more than enclosed islands, totally isolated among the settlements and their road system.
3. Bridges and Tunnels
Israel plans the construction of sixteen junctions with bridges (which will be guaranteed freeways for Israelis) and tunnels (which will be controlled passages for Palestinians, guarded by Israeli occupation forces). These will be the only passage points for Palestinians needing to travel from one area or city to another within the West Bank. While providing a facade of "maximum contiguity" among Palestinian areas to the international community — after all, the claim goes, these junctions connect the Palestinian Bantustans with each other, thus providing "contiguity" — this project is in fact aimed at guaranteeing full Israeli control over the West Bank even after a mock "withdrawal" of the Israeli army. All tunnels will be provided with gates (this is already the case in the village of Habla, in the Qalqiliya district, where the Palestinian population is at the mercy of the occupation forces in order to pass to or from their village), which will enable Israel to impose full curfew over the West Bank, perpetrate collective punishment at will, and control all Palestinian life. To do so, it will need no more than sixteen military cars, one for each junction.
4. The CBIZ (Cross Border Industrial Zones)
The project of enslaving the Palestinian people, once we have been completely deprived of land, resources, trade, and livelihood, will be completed by the construction of Israeli Industrial Zones on our stolen lands that are located outside the ghettos defined by the Apartheid Wall, the settlements, and their road system. This is the key element that provides economic sustainability to the rest of the Israeli plans. These Israeli-owned industrial zones will be sites for labor intensive industries where the Palestinian people will be forced to work as exploited labor, enriching the Israeli economy in the attempt to earn a meager living in the only way possible behind the gates of our ghettos. Israel has asked the U.S. and Europe to fund the CBIZ, and thus to legitimize the Israeli political project, under the pretext of providing "work opportunities" for the Palestinian population. The CBIZ is also presented as a practical economic solution to a potential humanitarian disaster — after all, the argument goes, if the international community does not provide funding for this project, then the Palestinian population will be dependent on humanitarian aid (or simply starve to death in their ghettos, which might be upsetting for the world to watch). This humanitarian aid — like many other costs of the occupation of Palestine and the expulsion of Palestinians from their land — would thus have to be paid by the international community. In any case, under the CBIZ plan, the Palestinian people will remain subjected, enslaved, and deprived of any possibility of self-determination.
The Apartheid Wall allows Israel to implement and link all of these policies into a coherent regime. It completes the Palestinian ghettos that have been prepared by the settlement policy and the road system. It also enables Israel to completely annex Jerusalem and to isolate it from the West Bank, thus providing Israel with a direct passage from the Mediterranean Sea to the Jordan Valley, while at the same time taking away the heart of Palestine from the Palestinian people.
In the light of these facts on the ground, it is obvious that no Palestinian state will be possible. It is also obvious that the continued violation of Palestinian rights and of international law remains the infrastructure of the new Israeli plans. The only future envisaged for the Palestinian people is one of ghettos and Bantustans, and a life under permanent Israeli control, domination, and humiliation.
A Palestinian farmer standing in front of the destruction caused by the Apartheid Wall in Beit Duqqu asked: "You took our country and killed our children. You destroyed our houses and bulldozed our fields and built your settlements, what more do you want? Why the Wall? ... You want to trap us like mice, you want to put a prison gate for us and start counting us as if we were some animals?!"
The Palestinian people will never accept a life lived under these conditions, where the occupation has been reinforced by the — seemingly — definitive colonization of the West Bank. This represents the completion of an apartheid system that by far exceeds the darkest times of South Africa, as it aims at the complete demise of our people.
We will never accept seeing our lands stolen and destroyed, our dignity taken away, our most fundamental rights violated every day, our holy sites barred in front of us, and Jerusalem — the historic, cultural, and economic capital of Palestine — annexed and isolated from our people. We will not surrender to this destiny. But we are asking for a response from the world to this project for our demise that is clear, effective, and immediate.
Six months after the International Court of Justice decision regarding the illegality of the Apartheid Wall, the settlement policy, and the Occupation, Israel has not given any sign that it will stop the construction of the Apartheid Wall. Rather, it has strengthened its colonial plans. International criticism has proven unable to bring about the changes that are needed. The international community has — as with all other UN resolutions regarding Palestinian rights — once again failed to take up its legal obligations to ensure that the ICJ decision will be implemented and international law respected.
It is the people of the world who are being called upon today to defend the values of justice and freedom. The call for the isolation of Israel, through boycott, divestment, and sanctions campaigns, needs to get louder every day, in every city around the world. Individuals, organizations, networks, and institutions are already promoting boycott, divestment and sanctions campaigns throughout the world. The trend towards a new international anti-apartheid movement is emerging, and this is the grassroots support upon which the Palestinian people can build in the face of continued failures by the international community.
These different campaigns around the world must be the beginning of a process that will make Israel pay a price for its crimes. Such a worldwide movement is necessary in order to end this vicious blend of occupation, expulsion, ghettoization, which will otherwise lead — as the new Israeli plans reveal when they are examined closely, away from the media show surrounding the Palestinian election process — to the total enslavement of a whole people.
http://electronicintifada.net/v2/article3523.shtml
An appalling plan for Palestine is shaping up behind Israeli slogans of "disengagement"; behind the British initiative to revive "the Road Map"; and behind the U.S. drive to force through the completion of Israeli plans that finalize the Bantustanization of the Palestinian people. All three are combining to push for an end to all Palestinian resistance, which is seen as a pre-condition for controlling the Middle East from Jerusalem to Baghdad. The U.S. administration in particular is highly aware that any possible chance of success for the occupation of Iraq, and for U.S.-Israeli plans to shape the future of the Greater Middle East, depend on their ability to create "stability" for the Israeli colonial project of annexation, expulsion, and occupation in Palestine.
Among the recent plans announced by Israel, some were mere masquerades for the international media, while others revealed concrete Israeli projects. The latest modification to the path of the Apartheid Wall was a plan of the first kind. These supposed modifications were nothing more than the result of U.S. and international pressure demanding maps that would enable them to defend the Wall in front of their constituencies and public opinion. The "new map" of the Wall represents a contorted game of numbers and definitions that has "lowered" the percentage of West Bank land stolen and destroyed by the Apartheid Wall to 6.1 percent.
But of course, as the media and political leaders praising the "new" plan inevitably fail to point out, this 6.1 percent needs to be added to the 11.8 percent annexed by the settlements and the 29.1 percent isolated in the Jordan Valley. Without even taking into account the additional land that has also been stolen from the Palestinian people for the construction of the settlers-only roads, this makes a total of 47 percent of the West Bank, and reveals itself as absolutely no different from the 47 percent that Israel intended to annex before the supposed modifications.
This game of numbers is also aimed at re-directing the way that the situation on the ground is talked about. It steers attention towards the size of the Bantustans being forced upon the Palestinian people, as if it was not the very fact that our people are being closed off behind walls that should create the outrage, rather than the question of whether these ghettos should be slightly larger. We are not fighting for bigger ghettos or for more colorful walls, but for liberation and justice in our land.
The real Israeli political project, meanwhile, can be found in the "disengagement plan" and the initiatives connected to this plan. The disengagement plan, far from being a withdrawal or giving the Palestinian people the right to statehood, demarcates in fact the full Bantustanization of our people. The rhetoric of the plan hides one of the best-elaborated and most effectively planned projects for the enslavement and destruction of an entire people.
This plan consists of four main construction projects that have been submitted to the public and are intimately linked to the construction of the Apartheid Wall:
1. The Building of New Settlements and the Expansion of Existing Settlements
Settlements have always been at the core of the colonial project to control Palestine. The so-called "disengagement plan" claims to be about the dismantling of settlements: that is, the evacuation of settlements in the Gaza Strip and of four minor settlements in the West Bank near Jenin. But at the same time, Israel has announced the annexation of all the other approximately 200 settlements in the Occupied West Bank and Jerusalem. In addition, Israel is currently expanding and constructing new settlements in the Tulkarem and Qalqiliya areas, ensuring the permanent annexation of the Palestinian lands isolated by the Wall.
2. More Settlers-Only "By-Pass" Roads
These fenced bypass roads, heavily guarded by the Israeli military, are for settlers only — Palestinians are not allowed to use or cross them. These roads cut through the West Bank and destroy the Palestinian road system, allowing the settlers free access everywhere while at the same time annexing lands and isolating Palestinian communities from each other in the same way the Apartheid Wall does. Israel has announced the construction of a further 500 km of roads to reinforce this apartheid road network. This will ensure that Palestinian residential areas are nothing more than enclosed islands, totally isolated among the settlements and their road system.
3. Bridges and Tunnels
Israel plans the construction of sixteen junctions with bridges (which will be guaranteed freeways for Israelis) and tunnels (which will be controlled passages for Palestinians, guarded by Israeli occupation forces). These will be the only passage points for Palestinians needing to travel from one area or city to another within the West Bank. While providing a facade of "maximum contiguity" among Palestinian areas to the international community — after all, the claim goes, these junctions connect the Palestinian Bantustans with each other, thus providing "contiguity" — this project is in fact aimed at guaranteeing full Israeli control over the West Bank even after a mock "withdrawal" of the Israeli army. All tunnels will be provided with gates (this is already the case in the village of Habla, in the Qalqiliya district, where the Palestinian population is at the mercy of the occupation forces in order to pass to or from their village), which will enable Israel to impose full curfew over the West Bank, perpetrate collective punishment at will, and control all Palestinian life. To do so, it will need no more than sixteen military cars, one for each junction.
4. The CBIZ (Cross Border Industrial Zones)
The project of enslaving the Palestinian people, once we have been completely deprived of land, resources, trade, and livelihood, will be completed by the construction of Israeli Industrial Zones on our stolen lands that are located outside the ghettos defined by the Apartheid Wall, the settlements, and their road system. This is the key element that provides economic sustainability to the rest of the Israeli plans. These Israeli-owned industrial zones will be sites for labor intensive industries where the Palestinian people will be forced to work as exploited labor, enriching the Israeli economy in the attempt to earn a meager living in the only way possible behind the gates of our ghettos. Israel has asked the U.S. and Europe to fund the CBIZ, and thus to legitimize the Israeli political project, under the pretext of providing "work opportunities" for the Palestinian population. The CBIZ is also presented as a practical economic solution to a potential humanitarian disaster — after all, the argument goes, if the international community does not provide funding for this project, then the Palestinian population will be dependent on humanitarian aid (or simply starve to death in their ghettos, which might be upsetting for the world to watch). This humanitarian aid — like many other costs of the occupation of Palestine and the expulsion of Palestinians from their land — would thus have to be paid by the international community. In any case, under the CBIZ plan, the Palestinian people will remain subjected, enslaved, and deprived of any possibility of self-determination.
The Apartheid Wall allows Israel to implement and link all of these policies into a coherent regime. It completes the Palestinian ghettos that have been prepared by the settlement policy and the road system. It also enables Israel to completely annex Jerusalem and to isolate it from the West Bank, thus providing Israel with a direct passage from the Mediterranean Sea to the Jordan Valley, while at the same time taking away the heart of Palestine from the Palestinian people.
In the light of these facts on the ground, it is obvious that no Palestinian state will be possible. It is also obvious that the continued violation of Palestinian rights and of international law remains the infrastructure of the new Israeli plans. The only future envisaged for the Palestinian people is one of ghettos and Bantustans, and a life under permanent Israeli control, domination, and humiliation.
A Palestinian farmer standing in front of the destruction caused by the Apartheid Wall in Beit Duqqu asked: "You took our country and killed our children. You destroyed our houses and bulldozed our fields and built your settlements, what more do you want? Why the Wall? ... You want to trap us like mice, you want to put a prison gate for us and start counting us as if we were some animals?!"
The Palestinian people will never accept a life lived under these conditions, where the occupation has been reinforced by the — seemingly — definitive colonization of the West Bank. This represents the completion of an apartheid system that by far exceeds the darkest times of South Africa, as it aims at the complete demise of our people.
We will never accept seeing our lands stolen and destroyed, our dignity taken away, our most fundamental rights violated every day, our holy sites barred in front of us, and Jerusalem — the historic, cultural, and economic capital of Palestine — annexed and isolated from our people. We will not surrender to this destiny. But we are asking for a response from the world to this project for our demise that is clear, effective, and immediate.
Six months after the International Court of Justice decision regarding the illegality of the Apartheid Wall, the settlement policy, and the Occupation, Israel has not given any sign that it will stop the construction of the Apartheid Wall. Rather, it has strengthened its colonial plans. International criticism has proven unable to bring about the changes that are needed. The international community has — as with all other UN resolutions regarding Palestinian rights — once again failed to take up its legal obligations to ensure that the ICJ decision will be implemented and international law respected.
It is the people of the world who are being called upon today to defend the values of justice and freedom. The call for the isolation of Israel, through boycott, divestment, and sanctions campaigns, needs to get louder every day, in every city around the world. Individuals, organizations, networks, and institutions are already promoting boycott, divestment and sanctions campaigns throughout the world. The trend towards a new international anti-apartheid movement is emerging, and this is the grassroots support upon which the Palestinian people can build in the face of continued failures by the international community.
These different campaigns around the world must be the beginning of a process that will make Israel pay a price for its crimes. Such a worldwide movement is necessary in order to end this vicious blend of occupation, expulsion, ghettoization, which will otherwise lead — as the new Israeli plans reveal when they are examined closely, away from the media show surrounding the Palestinian election process — to the total enslavement of a whole people.
http://electronicintifada.net/v2/article3523.shtml
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These idiot arabs will never be satisfied...looks like they don't really want a state of their own...the world really doesn't need a 23rd arab nation anyway.
Time to send them back to Jordan and Egypt...
Time to send them back to Jordan and Egypt...
Why is this filth permitted here? Are the editors racist or what?
Why is this filth permitted here? Are the editors racist or what? Are they getting paid?
Wow, within two minutes of someone making a racist post, nessie complains that it hasn't been taken down. It's almost as if he's waiting for someone to post something racist, just so he can use it to condemn Indybay.
Or maybe he's not waiting for it; maybe he's posting it himself. It would certainly serve his anti-Indybay agenda to do stuff like that, wouldn't it. Absolutely.
@%<
Or maybe he's not waiting for it; maybe he's posting it himself. It would certainly serve his anti-Indybay agenda to do stuff like that, wouldn't it. Absolutely.
@%<
That's just about the time it would take nessie to type and post the short pointed follow-up comment, criticizing indybay, after posting the first offending set-up comment.
ZENIT - The World Seen From Rome
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Code: ZE04111427
Date: 2004-11-14
Christians in Palestine Concerned About Their Future
Analysis of Correspondent in the Holy Land
JERUSALEM, NOV. 12, 2004 (Zenit.org).- While Yasser Arafat's burial was taking place in the Mukata of Ramallah, Christians of the Palestinian territories were wondering about their future.
Having become a small minority -- 50,000 in the midst of more than 3 million Muslims --, the death of the president of the Palestinian National Authority has come at a time when the political, administrative, and police structures often discriminate against them," explained Graziano Motta, correspondent in the Holy Land of Vatican Radio and of the Italian newspaper Avvenire.
"They have been continually exposed to pressures by Muslim activists and have been forced to profess fidelity to the intifada," the journalist reported.
"Frequently, there are cases in which the Muslims expropriate houses and lands belonging to Catholics, and often the intervention of the authorities has been lacking in addressing acts of violence against young women or offenses against the Christian faith," Motta indicated.
On several occasions, His Beatitude Michel Sabbah, Latin Patriarch of Jerusalem, who headed the Holy See delegation at Arafat's funeral, personally asked the deceased leader to intervene, and had established with him "a friendly and direct relationship," he continued.
"On occasions he intervened in some discussions between Christians and Muslims, especially in the region of Bethlehem, to proffer a solution and redress relations," the patriarch himself said on Thursday on Vatican Radio. However, he did not always succeed as sometimes Arafat could not count on the obedience of the men of his apparatus.
"Arafat leaves Christians, and Catholics in particular, an ambiguous and potentially negative heritage in regard to long-term relations with the state entity," he added.
"Considering Christians a part of the Arab socio-political reality in the struggle for independence, he tried to involve them as much as possible, exalting Palestine as Holy Land due to the presence of holy sites for Muslims and Christians, but without ever mentioning the Jews," he said.
"And he ignored -- and in practice boycotted -- the proposal of a special status for the Jewish, Christians, and Muslim holy sites in Jerusalem. In the name of Islam, he was firm in his claim for Palestine's exclusive sovereignty over the Holy City (Al-Quds)."
"He approved the draft of a Constitutional Charter for the future Palestinian state which did not take into account the secular and plural characteristic (that he said he promoted) to affirm the Muslim character," the correspondent noted.
"This is in potential contradiction with the commitments assumed in the Basic Agreement between the Holy See and the Palestine Liberation Organization in 2000, which he promoted to imitate the Fundamental Agreement of 1993 between the Holy See and Israel," he stressed.
This agreement "affirms the equality of all citizens, regardless of their religious faith, and respect of their freedom of religion and conscience."
------
MODERATE MAHMOUD? DON'T ASK THE IMPOSSIBLE OF THE NEW PALESTINIAN LEADER. - Demand the Possible Instead
Por Clifford D. May
Colaboraciones nº 232 | 14 de Enero de 2005
Descargar PDF Imprimir
(Published in the Foundation for Defense of Democracies. January 13, 2005)
Americans, Europeans, Israelis, diplomats, reporters, editorialists -- just about everybody wants Mahmoud Abbas, the newly elected president of the Palestinian Authority, to be a moderate. So they keep saying that he is a moderate as if, by wizardry, repeating the word will make it true.
But Abbas is not a moderate. And that's OK. Because, paradoxically, a moderate could not, at this moment, facilitate a breakthrough in the Arab-Israeli conflict. Abbas can, if he wants to. Think this through with me.
Abbas (A.K.A. Abu Mazen) was educated in Syria and the Soviet Union. His doctorate was on what he called a “secret relationship” between Nazis and Zionists. Essentially, he blamed the Jews for the Holocaust which he also argued has been greatly exaggerated. In other words, he is a conspiracy theorist and a Holocaust denier – nothing moderate about that.
He was a close associate of PLO leader and terrorist pioneer Yasser Arafat. Abu Daoud, who plotted the massacre of 11 Israeli athletes during the 1972 Munich Olympics, wrote that Abbas provided the funds for that atrocity. Not exactly something a moderate would do, is it? Has Abbas changed his views in recent years? Is he now, as the Washington Post recently stated, "a strong and courageous opponent of violence against Israel and a strong supporter of Palestinian compromises to move toward a two-state solution"? No evidence suggests that. Abbas has never voiced opposition to terrorism -- not even to the intentional slaughter of children. Instead, he has praised suicide bombers as “martyrs” and allowed terrorists to carry him on their shoulders.
What he has said is that said that such tactics are now harming, rather than helping, the Palestinian cause. "This is not the time for this kind of act,” he admonished Hamas terrorists earlier this month. Nor has Abbas ever told Palestinians that painful compromises will be necessary. Indeed, in this campaign, he said the opposite. He called Israel the “Zionist enemy” and insisted on the “right to return” – the demand that, while Israelis must leave all “Palestinian territories,” all of Israel must be opened to settlement by Palestinian “refugees,” their families and their descendants – more than 4 million people. That would mean the destruction of the Jewish state, a condition no Israeli leader can accept.
But, again, these facts are not necessarily cause for pessimism. On the contrary, if Abbas were really a moderate, he would not have won this election; indeed, it is doubtful he would have survived it. If Abbas is not a moderate, what is he? Perhaps – and here's the hope -- he is a pragmatist, someone willing to say that it is not realistic, at least at this point in history, to pursue the dream of destroying Israel, of killing the Jews or driving them out once and for all, as they long ago were driven out of Iraq, Egypt, Libya and many other lands where they had lived since long before those places were conquered by Arabs.
A pragmatist would say that the Jewish state is a reality, and that serious people accommodate reality. Abbas has said that the “intifada,” the terrorist war launched against Israel in 2000 after Arafat rejected the Israeli offer of statehood at Camp David, has become counter-productive for Palestinians. He could add that if the birth of a Palestinian state must await Israeli acceptance of a “right” of Palestinians to dominate them within their own borders, there will never be such a state – and that is too high a price for Palestinians to pay.
Finally, he could point to the unprecedented opportunity now within the Palestinians' grasp: Despite opposition from his own Likud party, Israeli Prime Minister Ariel Sharon has decided to remove Israeli villages from Gaza and turn the area over to the Palestinian Authority. All Sharon is asking in return is that Gaza not be a terrorist haven.
Abbas could acknowledge that this is a good deal for Palestinians. He could insist that the PA keep its part of the bargain – not because he opposes killing Israelis (a moderate position) but because if the P.A. does not, he is sure Sharon will unleash harsh reprisals against the killers and those who harbor them (a pragmatic position). The U.S., Europe and, yes, even the U.N. could help by saying to the Palestinians: “Keep the peace and we'll provide aid, we'll invest, we'll do whatever we can. But keep up the terrorism and the unrealistic demands of Israel and you're on your own."
Arab leaders who claim they want to resolve this conflict should be called upon to prove it. They, too, needn't pose as moderates. They need only urge Abbas – strongly and publicly -- to take the pragmatic course.
*Clifford D. May, a former New York Times foreign correspondent, is the president of the Foundation for the Defense of Democracies a policy institute focusing on terrorism.
© 2003 GEES - Grupo de Estudios Estratégicos
Por Clifford D. May
Colaboraciones nº 232 | 14 de Enero de 2005
Descargar PDF Imprimir
(Published in the Foundation for Defense of Democracies. January 13, 2005)
Americans, Europeans, Israelis, diplomats, reporters, editorialists -- just about everybody wants Mahmoud Abbas, the newly elected president of the Palestinian Authority, to be a moderate. So they keep saying that he is a moderate as if, by wizardry, repeating the word will make it true.
But Abbas is not a moderate. And that's OK. Because, paradoxically, a moderate could not, at this moment, facilitate a breakthrough in the Arab-Israeli conflict. Abbas can, if he wants to. Think this through with me.
Abbas (A.K.A. Abu Mazen) was educated in Syria and the Soviet Union. His doctorate was on what he called a “secret relationship” between Nazis and Zionists. Essentially, he blamed the Jews for the Holocaust which he also argued has been greatly exaggerated. In other words, he is a conspiracy theorist and a Holocaust denier – nothing moderate about that.
He was a close associate of PLO leader and terrorist pioneer Yasser Arafat. Abu Daoud, who plotted the massacre of 11 Israeli athletes during the 1972 Munich Olympics, wrote that Abbas provided the funds for that atrocity. Not exactly something a moderate would do, is it? Has Abbas changed his views in recent years? Is he now, as the Washington Post recently stated, "a strong and courageous opponent of violence against Israel and a strong supporter of Palestinian compromises to move toward a two-state solution"? No evidence suggests that. Abbas has never voiced opposition to terrorism -- not even to the intentional slaughter of children. Instead, he has praised suicide bombers as “martyrs” and allowed terrorists to carry him on their shoulders.
What he has said is that said that such tactics are now harming, rather than helping, the Palestinian cause. "This is not the time for this kind of act,” he admonished Hamas terrorists earlier this month. Nor has Abbas ever told Palestinians that painful compromises will be necessary. Indeed, in this campaign, he said the opposite. He called Israel the “Zionist enemy” and insisted on the “right to return” – the demand that, while Israelis must leave all “Palestinian territories,” all of Israel must be opened to settlement by Palestinian “refugees,” their families and their descendants – more than 4 million people. That would mean the destruction of the Jewish state, a condition no Israeli leader can accept.
But, again, these facts are not necessarily cause for pessimism. On the contrary, if Abbas were really a moderate, he would not have won this election; indeed, it is doubtful he would have survived it. If Abbas is not a moderate, what is he? Perhaps – and here's the hope -- he is a pragmatist, someone willing to say that it is not realistic, at least at this point in history, to pursue the dream of destroying Israel, of killing the Jews or driving them out once and for all, as they long ago were driven out of Iraq, Egypt, Libya and many other lands where they had lived since long before those places were conquered by Arabs.
A pragmatist would say that the Jewish state is a reality, and that serious people accommodate reality. Abbas has said that the “intifada,” the terrorist war launched against Israel in 2000 after Arafat rejected the Israeli offer of statehood at Camp David, has become counter-productive for Palestinians. He could add that if the birth of a Palestinian state must await Israeli acceptance of a “right” of Palestinians to dominate them within their own borders, there will never be such a state – and that is too high a price for Palestinians to pay.
Finally, he could point to the unprecedented opportunity now within the Palestinians' grasp: Despite opposition from his own Likud party, Israeli Prime Minister Ariel Sharon has decided to remove Israeli villages from Gaza and turn the area over to the Palestinian Authority. All Sharon is asking in return is that Gaza not be a terrorist haven.
Abbas could acknowledge that this is a good deal for Palestinians. He could insist that the PA keep its part of the bargain – not because he opposes killing Israelis (a moderate position) but because if the P.A. does not, he is sure Sharon will unleash harsh reprisals against the killers and those who harbor them (a pragmatic position). The U.S., Europe and, yes, even the U.N. could help by saying to the Palestinians: “Keep the peace and we'll provide aid, we'll invest, we'll do whatever we can. But keep up the terrorism and the unrealistic demands of Israel and you're on your own."
Arab leaders who claim they want to resolve this conflict should be called upon to prove it. They, too, needn't pose as moderates. They need only urge Abbas – strongly and publicly -- to take the pragmatic course.
*Clifford D. May, a former New York Times foreign correspondent, is the president of the Foundation for the Defense of Democracies a policy institute focusing on terrorism.
© 2003 GEES - Grupo de Estudios Estratégicos
before the current election Abbas was one of the least popular Palestinian leaders but the excitement by Israel for his election gave those in Fatah some hope that he would be able to negotiate and achieve something for Palestinians since Israel would be willing to talk to him.
But the PA has no power and it was always obvious that more militant groups wouold not curb theuir actions just because Arbbas said he wanted them to. So we have now what could have been expected; violence continues, Israel has already broken off all talks with Abbas, and the next step is going to be demonization of Abbas as a terrorist who can not be talked to (and if Israel really doesnt care about world public opinion they may even assasinate Abbas in revenge for the actions of Hamas). One already sees the proIsrael crowd on the site denoucning Abbas for his past despite the fact that he was elected solely because Palestuinians thought he would please Israel.... whats one to do
But the PA has no power and it was always obvious that more militant groups wouold not curb theuir actions just because Arbbas said he wanted them to. So we have now what could have been expected; violence continues, Israel has already broken off all talks with Abbas, and the next step is going to be demonization of Abbas as a terrorist who can not be talked to (and if Israel really doesnt care about world public opinion they may even assasinate Abbas in revenge for the actions of Hamas). One already sees the proIsrael crowd on the site denoucning Abbas for his past despite the fact that he was elected solely because Palestuinians thought he would please Israel.... whats one to do
Israeli Prime Minister Ariel Sharon has ordered a freeze on all contacts with the Palestinians until their newly elected leader acts against militants.
The announcement comes after gunmen killed six Israelis at a Gaza Strip crossing point on Thursday night.
The attack was a blow to Mahmoud Abbas, who was elected on Sunday amid hopes he could promote new moves toward peace.
After his election, Mr Sharon called Mr Abbas to congratulate him and said he hoped to meet the new leader "soon".
But on Friday hopes for a speedy meeting appeared to be dashed.
"Israel informed international leaders today that there will be no meetings with Abbas until he makes a real effort to stop the terror," Mr Sharon's spokesman Assaf Shariv said, according to AP news agency.
Joint responsibility for Thursday's raid was claimed by three Palestinian groups, including Hamas and the al-Aqsa Martyrs' Brigades, which has links with Mr Abbas's Fatah movement.
http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/middle_east/4176141.stm
The announcement comes after gunmen killed six Israelis at a Gaza Strip crossing point on Thursday night.
The attack was a blow to Mahmoud Abbas, who was elected on Sunday amid hopes he could promote new moves toward peace.
After his election, Mr Sharon called Mr Abbas to congratulate him and said he hoped to meet the new leader "soon".
But on Friday hopes for a speedy meeting appeared to be dashed.
"Israel informed international leaders today that there will be no meetings with Abbas until he makes a real effort to stop the terror," Mr Sharon's spokesman Assaf Shariv said, according to AP news agency.
Joint responsibility for Thursday's raid was claimed by three Palestinian groups, including Hamas and the al-Aqsa Martyrs' Brigades, which has links with Mr Abbas's Fatah movement.
http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/middle_east/4176141.stm
"Israeli Prime Minister Ariel Sharon has ordered a freeze on all contacts with the Palestinians until their newly elected leader acts against militants. "
I guess that by "militants" you mean "terrorists".
_____
Jan. 14, 2005 21:52 | Updated Jan. 14, 2005 21:59
Attack at Karni crossing kills 6 Israelis
By MARGOT DUDKEVITCH
Advertisement
A deadly terrorist attack Thursday night at the Karni terminal crossing in the Gaza Strip killed six Israelis and wounded five more.
Three of the Israelis killed in the attack were residents of Sderot. Herzl Shlomo, 51, and Ivan Shmilov, 54, were both buried in Sderot Friday afternoon. Dror Gizri, 31, also from Sderot, will be buried on Sunday. Two Israeli-Arab truck drivers, Munam Abu Sabiya, 33, from Daburiya, and Ibrahim Kakhili, 46, from Umm el-Ghanam, where also laid to rest on Friday. Ofer Tiri, 23, from Ashkelon, will be laid to rest on Sunday.
The attack occurred shortly before 11 p.m., moments before the terminal was ready to close. Three terrorists placed a powerful bomb next to a metal door between the Israeli and Palestinian side of the crossing, creating a hole in the wall through which they entered. The Palestinians were killed in the gun battle that ensued with the Israeli security guards.
As evacuation efforts began, a mortar shell was fired at the crossing.
Magen David Adom officials said they evacuated five wounded civilian guards to the Soroka Medical Center in Beersheba, three of them in critical condition. Owing to the fierce gun battles at the site of the explosion, paramedics reported they had extreme difficulty in reaching the wounded.
The Aksa Martyrs Brigades claimed responsibility for the attack, as did Hamas and the umbrella Popular Resistance Committee. Fatah hailed "a martyrdom operation" at Karni, which is the main crossing point for goods transported to and from Gaza.
The Aksa Brigades claimed that they succeeded in sneaking a 100-kilogram bomb to the crossing. The attack was in response to the assassination of a member of the Aksa Brigades, the group said.
Severe damage was caused to the Karni terminal, the main crossing through which goods and merchandise are transported daily between Israel and the Gaza Strip. The crossing was opened lately as a gesture to new Palestinian Authority chairman Mahmoud Abbas. This is the first major terror attack since his election last week.
Security officials told The Jerusalem Post on Friday that terrorists have escalated their attempts to target the border crossings in the Gaza strip. The crossings symbolizes coexistence between Israel and the Palestinians, the officials said, as humanitarian assistance, goods and merchandise pass through it en route to the Gaza Strip.
Thursday night's attack is the fourth attack on a Gaza border crossings in the past month. In one attack, two weeks ago, Nissim Arviv, an Israeli working at the Erez industrial site, was critically wounded and later died of his wounds in a mortar attack on the site.
In another attack, which took place on December 12, Palestinians blew up the army's JVT outpost near the Rafah crossing, killing five soldiers. The crossing was closed following the attack and since then there has been no passage of Palestinians from the Gaza Strip to Egypt and vice versa.
I guess that by "militants" you mean "terrorists".
_____
Jan. 14, 2005 21:52 | Updated Jan. 14, 2005 21:59
Attack at Karni crossing kills 6 Israelis
By MARGOT DUDKEVITCH
Advertisement
A deadly terrorist attack Thursday night at the Karni terminal crossing in the Gaza Strip killed six Israelis and wounded five more.
Three of the Israelis killed in the attack were residents of Sderot. Herzl Shlomo, 51, and Ivan Shmilov, 54, were both buried in Sderot Friday afternoon. Dror Gizri, 31, also from Sderot, will be buried on Sunday. Two Israeli-Arab truck drivers, Munam Abu Sabiya, 33, from Daburiya, and Ibrahim Kakhili, 46, from Umm el-Ghanam, where also laid to rest on Friday. Ofer Tiri, 23, from Ashkelon, will be laid to rest on Sunday.
The attack occurred shortly before 11 p.m., moments before the terminal was ready to close. Three terrorists placed a powerful bomb next to a metal door between the Israeli and Palestinian side of the crossing, creating a hole in the wall through which they entered. The Palestinians were killed in the gun battle that ensued with the Israeli security guards.
As evacuation efforts began, a mortar shell was fired at the crossing.
Magen David Adom officials said they evacuated five wounded civilian guards to the Soroka Medical Center in Beersheba, three of them in critical condition. Owing to the fierce gun battles at the site of the explosion, paramedics reported they had extreme difficulty in reaching the wounded.
The Aksa Martyrs Brigades claimed responsibility for the attack, as did Hamas and the umbrella Popular Resistance Committee. Fatah hailed "a martyrdom operation" at Karni, which is the main crossing point for goods transported to and from Gaza.
The Aksa Brigades claimed that they succeeded in sneaking a 100-kilogram bomb to the crossing. The attack was in response to the assassination of a member of the Aksa Brigades, the group said.
Severe damage was caused to the Karni terminal, the main crossing through which goods and merchandise are transported daily between Israel and the Gaza Strip. The crossing was opened lately as a gesture to new Palestinian Authority chairman Mahmoud Abbas. This is the first major terror attack since his election last week.
Security officials told The Jerusalem Post on Friday that terrorists have escalated their attempts to target the border crossings in the Gaza strip. The crossings symbolizes coexistence between Israel and the Palestinians, the officials said, as humanitarian assistance, goods and merchandise pass through it en route to the Gaza Strip.
Thursday night's attack is the fourth attack on a Gaza border crossings in the past month. In one attack, two weeks ago, Nissim Arviv, an Israeli working at the Erez industrial site, was critically wounded and later died of his wounds in a mortar attack on the site.
In another attack, which took place on December 12, Palestinians blew up the army's JVT outpost near the Rafah crossing, killing five soldiers. The crossing was closed following the attack and since then there has been no passage of Palestinians from the Gaza Strip to Egypt and vice versa.
Jan. 13, 2005 23:01 | Updated Jan. 14, 2005 22:16
Sharon orders all contact severed with PA government
By MARGOT DUDKEVITCH AND JPOST STAFF
Prime Minister Ariel Sharon has ordered all contact cut with newly elected Palestinian leader Mahmoud Abbas until Abbas reins in terrorists, a Sharon spokesman said Friday.
The report comes following a deadly attack Thursday night at the Karni terminal crossing in the Gaza Strip, in which six Israelis were killed and five civilians wounded.
In response, Israel has announced that it will not negotiate with the PA until the attack is investigated and the perpetrators brought to justice.
"Israel informed international leaders today that there will be no meetings with Abbas until he makes a real effort to stop the terror," said Sharon spokesman Assaf Shariv.
Shariv said Israel made the decision because they believe PA security forces should have been able to thwart Thursday's attack, as the explosives-laden truck had to pass through a PA base in order to reach its destination at the Karni crossing.
Shariv said that Israel has informed officials from the US, EU, Britain and the Palestinians, and asked the countries to pressure the Palestinian Authority to crack down on terrorist organizations.
Palestinian Cabinet Minister Saeb Erekat confirmed this.
"Sharon's bureau called me this afternoon saying that they were suspending all contact with the Palestinian side," Erekat said.
Erekat spoke with CNN responding to Israel's dramatic move. "My response is: This is wrong," Erekat said.
He viewed the move as an outright sabotage of the chances of advancing peace, stressing that in order to break "this vicious cycle of violence" which is costing hundreds of Israeli and Palestinian lives, it is crucial to resume contact rather than suspend it.
"We need to resume contacts and negotiations, in order to revive hope in the minds of Palestinians and Israelis that peace is possible. Suspending ties serves nobody's purpose except the extremists on both sides," Erekat said.
Erekat said the gesture was extreme, and wholly unjustified, in particular because the PA's chairman-elect Mahmoud Abbas has not yet entered office, and so has not yet been in the position of authority to take steps against the violence.
Abbas will be sworn in as PA chairman at noon this Saturday in Ramallah.
"How can you blame him?" Erekat demanded. "How can you blame someone who has not yet entered the office of the Palestinian Authority?"
"We have begun contact with all factions, and we have vowed to fulfill our obligations under the roadmap, which calls for an end to Palestinian violence against Israel," Erekat said.
"I urge the Israeli government to reconsider," he added.
In a TV interview with CNN, Ra'anan Gissin, senior advisor to the prime minister, confirmed that Israel will not negotiate with the PA until it takes concrete steps against violence - specifically to investigate the recent attack and punish its perpetrators.
"We are burying our dead, we are bleeding to death while they are conducting talks with terrorist organizations. We want real steps taken, not just talk," Gissin said.
He pointed out that besides the discussions the Palestinian government is holding with terrorist organizations, they have not taken any genuine steps towards stopping or punishing attacks. Rather, it appears PA security forces are cooperating with the terrorists, Gissin said, noting that the attackers who carried out the Karni bombing had to pass through a PA base in order to reach their destination.
They have failed even to deploy security forces to the Gaza areas from which rocket attacks are constantly launched against Israel, he also pointed out.
Continued from page 1 of 2)
Meanwhile, in further response to the deadly attack, the Gaza Strip's three main terminal crossings – Karni, Erez and Rafah – were shut down until further notice, Defense Minister Shaul Mofaz and Chief of General Staff Lt.-Gen. Moshe Ya'alon said on Friday.
The Rafah crossing, in the southern Gaza Strip, and the Erez crossing, in the northern Gaza Strip, were both closed in past weeks following terrorist attacks, which cost the lives of Israeli civilians and security forces.
Mofaz and Ya'alon decided on Friday to close all three crossings until the Palestinian Authority takes the required measures to ensure the safety of those working at the crossings and passing through them.
Crossings are used daily by Palestinians to move from one area to another as well as to carry into Palestinian areas foods, medicines, and other necessary supplies.
"This is an appalling attempt to destroy Israeli efforts to benefit the lives of the Palestinian population and create a new reality," Mofaz was quoted by Israel Radio. The crossings "supply oxygen" for the lives of regular Palestinians, Mofaz said. "They [terrorists] are trying to destroy all chances [for peace]."
Ya'alon said Palestinian dissident groups are undermining the Palestinian
Authority, which is calling for the end of terror attacks and condemning them.
Gaza division commander Brig.-Gen. Aviv Kohavi said on Friday there have been constant plans by terrorists to target the areas where Israel is attempting to ease up restrictions and offer humanitarian assistance to the Palestinian public.
The terrorists are focusing on harming the border crossings, turning them into their strategic targets, Kohavi said.
Senior officers in Southern Command said that while there is no planned widespread operation in Gaza in retaliation to the terror attack, the IDF will choose the time and place to respond. Meanwhile, the army will continue operating as it has in the past weeks, deploying in certain areas to harm the terror infrastructures and destroy the capability of terror organizations to attack Israeli targets.
Sharon orders all contact severed with PA government
By MARGOT DUDKEVITCH AND JPOST STAFF
Prime Minister Ariel Sharon has ordered all contact cut with newly elected Palestinian leader Mahmoud Abbas until Abbas reins in terrorists, a Sharon spokesman said Friday.
The report comes following a deadly attack Thursday night at the Karni terminal crossing in the Gaza Strip, in which six Israelis were killed and five civilians wounded.
In response, Israel has announced that it will not negotiate with the PA until the attack is investigated and the perpetrators brought to justice.
"Israel informed international leaders today that there will be no meetings with Abbas until he makes a real effort to stop the terror," said Sharon spokesman Assaf Shariv.
Shariv said Israel made the decision because they believe PA security forces should have been able to thwart Thursday's attack, as the explosives-laden truck had to pass through a PA base in order to reach its destination at the Karni crossing.
Shariv said that Israel has informed officials from the US, EU, Britain and the Palestinians, and asked the countries to pressure the Palestinian Authority to crack down on terrorist organizations.
Palestinian Cabinet Minister Saeb Erekat confirmed this.
"Sharon's bureau called me this afternoon saying that they were suspending all contact with the Palestinian side," Erekat said.
Erekat spoke with CNN responding to Israel's dramatic move. "My response is: This is wrong," Erekat said.
He viewed the move as an outright sabotage of the chances of advancing peace, stressing that in order to break "this vicious cycle of violence" which is costing hundreds of Israeli and Palestinian lives, it is crucial to resume contact rather than suspend it.
"We need to resume contacts and negotiations, in order to revive hope in the minds of Palestinians and Israelis that peace is possible. Suspending ties serves nobody's purpose except the extremists on both sides," Erekat said.
Erekat said the gesture was extreme, and wholly unjustified, in particular because the PA's chairman-elect Mahmoud Abbas has not yet entered office, and so has not yet been in the position of authority to take steps against the violence.
Abbas will be sworn in as PA chairman at noon this Saturday in Ramallah.
"How can you blame him?" Erekat demanded. "How can you blame someone who has not yet entered the office of the Palestinian Authority?"
"We have begun contact with all factions, and we have vowed to fulfill our obligations under the roadmap, which calls for an end to Palestinian violence against Israel," Erekat said.
"I urge the Israeli government to reconsider," he added.
In a TV interview with CNN, Ra'anan Gissin, senior advisor to the prime minister, confirmed that Israel will not negotiate with the PA until it takes concrete steps against violence - specifically to investigate the recent attack and punish its perpetrators.
"We are burying our dead, we are bleeding to death while they are conducting talks with terrorist organizations. We want real steps taken, not just talk," Gissin said.
He pointed out that besides the discussions the Palestinian government is holding with terrorist organizations, they have not taken any genuine steps towards stopping or punishing attacks. Rather, it appears PA security forces are cooperating with the terrorists, Gissin said, noting that the attackers who carried out the Karni bombing had to pass through a PA base in order to reach their destination.
They have failed even to deploy security forces to the Gaza areas from which rocket attacks are constantly launched against Israel, he also pointed out.
Continued from page 1 of 2)
Meanwhile, in further response to the deadly attack, the Gaza Strip's three main terminal crossings – Karni, Erez and Rafah – were shut down until further notice, Defense Minister Shaul Mofaz and Chief of General Staff Lt.-Gen. Moshe Ya'alon said on Friday.
The Rafah crossing, in the southern Gaza Strip, and the Erez crossing, in the northern Gaza Strip, were both closed in past weeks following terrorist attacks, which cost the lives of Israeli civilians and security forces.
Mofaz and Ya'alon decided on Friday to close all three crossings until the Palestinian Authority takes the required measures to ensure the safety of those working at the crossings and passing through them.
Crossings are used daily by Palestinians to move from one area to another as well as to carry into Palestinian areas foods, medicines, and other necessary supplies.
"This is an appalling attempt to destroy Israeli efforts to benefit the lives of the Palestinian population and create a new reality," Mofaz was quoted by Israel Radio. The crossings "supply oxygen" for the lives of regular Palestinians, Mofaz said. "They [terrorists] are trying to destroy all chances [for peace]."
Ya'alon said Palestinian dissident groups are undermining the Palestinian
Authority, which is calling for the end of terror attacks and condemning them.
Gaza division commander Brig.-Gen. Aviv Kohavi said on Friday there have been constant plans by terrorists to target the areas where Israel is attempting to ease up restrictions and offer humanitarian assistance to the Palestinian public.
The terrorists are focusing on harming the border crossings, turning them into their strategic targets, Kohavi said.
Senior officers in Southern Command said that while there is no planned widespread operation in Gaza in retaliation to the terror attack, the IDF will choose the time and place to respond. Meanwhile, the army will continue operating as it has in the past weeks, deploying in certain areas to harm the terror infrastructures and destroy the capability of terror organizations to attack Israeli targets.
What makes someone a terrorist or an act an act of terrorism? Is an attack on the IDF by a Palestinian group terrorism or is it only terrorism if the targets are civlians?
When the Iraq's gassed the Kurds, was that terrorism? What about the Rwanda genocide? If terorrism just means an unjust or horrible act, would that make every bomb dropped in a war one disagrees with an act of terrorism? Was the US overthrow of Allende in Chile a terrorist act? What about the El Salvadoran death squads that killed leftists and assasinated Romero?
If one reads the newspapers terrorism is used for Muslim rebel groups that the US disagrees with (it was never used to describe the Mujahaden in Afghanistan when the US supported them). It is also used to describe Communist rebel groups in S America, and seperatist movements in Europe.
The dictionary definition of terrorism is "The unlawful use or threatened use of force or violence by a person or an organized group against people or property with the intention of intimidating or coercing societies or governments" Which sortof sounds clear except that definition would include all wars one deems to be illegal since all war are carried out to coerce societies or governments.
Terrorism seems to really mean "an act of violence by a group hated by Republicans in the US". But its not really even used that way since many attrocities are never called terrorism when the acts are not carried out by Arabs or Muslims. In terms of the common use these days of the words terrorism or terrorist it seems to be almost a racial epithet used specifically to denounce Arabs or Muslims when they do thing that are bad. Thus when Palestinians attack military targets its by deifnitions terrorism but when Baruch Goldstein massacred 29 Palestinian muslims during friday prayers it was the act of a crazy person (but not a terrorist acts since he wasnt a Muslim or Arab). When someone uses the word terrorist it should be considered every bit offense as the N word or other forms of hate speah (and as with that word saying "I dont consider all black people to be nig**s just those who do bad things" isnt an excuse for the use of the word but instead a clear sign that one is a biggot)
When the Iraq's gassed the Kurds, was that terrorism? What about the Rwanda genocide? If terorrism just means an unjust or horrible act, would that make every bomb dropped in a war one disagrees with an act of terrorism? Was the US overthrow of Allende in Chile a terrorist act? What about the El Salvadoran death squads that killed leftists and assasinated Romero?
If one reads the newspapers terrorism is used for Muslim rebel groups that the US disagrees with (it was never used to describe the Mujahaden in Afghanistan when the US supported them). It is also used to describe Communist rebel groups in S America, and seperatist movements in Europe.
The dictionary definition of terrorism is "The unlawful use or threatened use of force or violence by a person or an organized group against people or property with the intention of intimidating or coercing societies or governments" Which sortof sounds clear except that definition would include all wars one deems to be illegal since all war are carried out to coerce societies or governments.
Terrorism seems to really mean "an act of violence by a group hated by Republicans in the US". But its not really even used that way since many attrocities are never called terrorism when the acts are not carried out by Arabs or Muslims. In terms of the common use these days of the words terrorism or terrorist it seems to be almost a racial epithet used specifically to denounce Arabs or Muslims when they do thing that are bad. Thus when Palestinians attack military targets its by deifnitions terrorism but when Baruch Goldstein massacred 29 Palestinian muslims during friday prayers it was the act of a crazy person (but not a terrorist acts since he wasnt a Muslim or Arab). When someone uses the word terrorist it should be considered every bit offense as the N word or other forms of hate speah (and as with that word saying "I dont consider all black people to be nig**s just those who do bad things" isnt an excuse for the use of the word but instead a clear sign that one is a biggot)
JA
What the Israelis are doing to the Palestinians is so horrible i.e. the death of over 600 Palestinian children and the rest of the atrocities, that the only way the forgers and imposters can deal with it is to joke about it. They keep forgetting that God is watching them very closely and their bad deeds and lies will not go unpunished.
What the Israelis are doing to the Palestinians is so horrible i.e. the death of over 600 Palestinian children and the rest of the atrocities, that the only way the forgers and imposters can deal with it is to joke about it. They keep forgetting that God is watching them very closely and their bad deeds and lies will not go unpunished.
"What makes someone a terrorist or an act an act of terrorism? Is an attack on the IDF by a Palestinian group terrorism or is it only terrorism if the targets are civlians?"
It is a terrorist act if they target civilians. As for targeting soldiers, it depends:
-is there an official declaration of war? If not, it is terrorism.
-were the attackers wearing a uniform or something identifying them as members of some army? if not, it is terrorism.
-is it known who their officers are? if not, it is terrorism.
"When the Iraq's gassed the Kurds, was that terrorism? What about the Rwanda genocide? If terorrism just means an unjust or horrible act, would that make every bomb dropped in a war one disagrees with an act of terrorism? Was the US overthrow of Allende in Chile a terrorist act? What about the El Salvadoran death squads that killed leftists and assasinated Romero? "
When Iraq gassed the Kurds, the Rwanda genocide, the squads that killed leftist in Salvador were terrorism of state, as it is called.
The US overthrow of Allende was a coup.
"If one reads the newspapers terrorism is used for Muslim rebel groups that the US disagrees with (it was never used to describe the Mujahaden in Afghanistan when the US supported them). It is also used to describe Communist rebel groups in S America, and seperatist movements in Europe."
"Terrorism" is not only used for Muslim rebel groups that the US disagrees with:
-There are non-Muslim groups the US considers to be terrorists.
-Al-Qaeda attacked the US: does the US have to agree with the attackers because they are Muslims? Was that a terrorist act or not?
The Mujahadeen in Afghanistan were part of an army fighting against another army.
"Terrorist" is not used to describe Communist or separatist groups anywhere. It is used to describe groups which kidnap people, blow car-bombs, shoot people dead, etc.
It is a terrorist act if they target civilians. As for targeting soldiers, it depends:
-is there an official declaration of war? If not, it is terrorism.
-were the attackers wearing a uniform or something identifying them as members of some army? if not, it is terrorism.
-is it known who their officers are? if not, it is terrorism.
"When the Iraq's gassed the Kurds, was that terrorism? What about the Rwanda genocide? If terorrism just means an unjust or horrible act, would that make every bomb dropped in a war one disagrees with an act of terrorism? Was the US overthrow of Allende in Chile a terrorist act? What about the El Salvadoran death squads that killed leftists and assasinated Romero? "
When Iraq gassed the Kurds, the Rwanda genocide, the squads that killed leftist in Salvador were terrorism of state, as it is called.
The US overthrow of Allende was a coup.
"If one reads the newspapers terrorism is used for Muslim rebel groups that the US disagrees with (it was never used to describe the Mujahaden in Afghanistan when the US supported them). It is also used to describe Communist rebel groups in S America, and seperatist movements in Europe."
"Terrorism" is not only used for Muslim rebel groups that the US disagrees with:
-There are non-Muslim groups the US considers to be terrorists.
-Al-Qaeda attacked the US: does the US have to agree with the attackers because they are Muslims? Was that a terrorist act or not?
The Mujahadeen in Afghanistan were part of an army fighting against another army.
"Terrorist" is not used to describe Communist or separatist groups anywhere. It is used to describe groups which kidnap people, blow car-bombs, shoot people dead, etc.
"and as with that word saying "I dont consider all black people to be nig**s just those who do bad things" isnt an excuse for the use of the word but instead a clear sign that one is a biggot) "
Here I agree with you: that's racism. Although I didn't know somebody could make an statement like that.
Here I agree with you: that's racism. Although I didn't know somebody could make an statement like that.
as one of your blacks and nig**s as you refer to us I hope to meet you personaly some day for a personal explanation of your treatment of my people
lamond
lamond
The expresion "blacks and nig**s" isn't mine. I took it from somebody I was replying to (look above). Moreover, I didn't even know of the existance of such an expression and so it is not my style.
So I have to give you no explanation. On the contrary, it is you who should give me an explanation of your calling me racist.
So I have to give you no explanation. On the contrary, it is you who should give me an explanation of your calling me racist.
For lamond: see above.
Once again, you all end up in some kind of flame war. I'm beginning to think that this is a deliberate attempt to disrupt IMC - or rather, I have thought that for some time, but it's taken me a while to speak up.
Look, it's open publishing. You can publish anything you want, and in the vast majority of cases, it won't even be so much as hidden.
In my opinion, you're not here to respect the democratization of media. Instead, you want to filibuster until all other voices are drown out. Even if you're not violating the letter of IMCs charter, you're clearly violating its spirit.
And as far as palestine goes: even if I was 100% in favor of Israel under all circumstances, your behavior would be enough to either write you off as wingnuts or to reconsider my point of view. Also, please don't try to say "well, the anti-zionists are doing it too," that's just immature. You keep fanning the flames, don't be surprised when you get the same back.
Do feel free to keep spouting off, though. In my opinion, you're doing a good job of making the case against Israeli's Palestinian policies every time you open your vitriolic mouth. Bravo.
Look, it's open publishing. You can publish anything you want, and in the vast majority of cases, it won't even be so much as hidden.
In my opinion, you're not here to respect the democratization of media. Instead, you want to filibuster until all other voices are drown out. Even if you're not violating the letter of IMCs charter, you're clearly violating its spirit.
And as far as palestine goes: even if I was 100% in favor of Israel under all circumstances, your behavior would be enough to either write you off as wingnuts or to reconsider my point of view. Also, please don't try to say "well, the anti-zionists are doing it too," that's just immature. You keep fanning the flames, don't be surprised when you get the same back.
Do feel free to keep spouting off, though. In my opinion, you're doing a good job of making the case against Israeli's Palestinian policies every time you open your vitriolic mouth. Bravo.
Why are you generalizing about all of us people who aren't anti-Zionist? Not all of us engage in the immature behavior or nor emit the vitriolic rhetoric you accuse all of us of. Could it be you have a beef with the content rather than the temperature?
The content is the problem. Zionism is racism. Racist propaganda doesn't belong on Indymedia.
>Why are you generalizing about all of us people who aren't anti-Zionist? Not all of us engage in the immature behavior or nor emit the vitriolic rhetoric you accuse all of us of. Could it be you have a beef with the content rather than the temperature?<
No, I have a beef with *you*. While I will openly admit that *both* sides of this debate are raising the temperature, the fact remains that every single time this topic comes up, there you are, along with Sefarad, Wendy, Nessie and so on. Why the hell can't you accept that the primary purpose of this site is to disseminate news? If this wasn't an IMC project, *all* of you would probably have been banned a long time ago, and the posting either eliminated altogether, put on a moderated status, or at least reprimanded with a stern "brief, respectful comments please" ultimatum from the site facilitators.
Please, please, *please* stop pointing fingers at others, and look in the mirror.
No, I have a beef with *you*. While I will openly admit that *both* sides of this debate are raising the temperature, the fact remains that every single time this topic comes up, there you are, along with Sefarad, Wendy, Nessie and so on. Why the hell can't you accept that the primary purpose of this site is to disseminate news? If this wasn't an IMC project, *all* of you would probably have been banned a long time ago, and the posting either eliminated altogether, put on a moderated status, or at least reprimanded with a stern "brief, respectful comments please" ultimatum from the site facilitators.
Please, please, *please* stop pointing fingers at others, and look in the mirror.
"the fact remains that every single time this topic comes up, there you are, along with Sefarad, Wendy, Nessie and so on. "
I am puzzled: you single me out and still I am charged with personalizing. Is that the reason why I am hated by billions?
Sorry, you're actually upset with me for my temerity to comment on outrageous or dubious comments and articles. While I recognize your anger, it's not my fault you fail to distinguish between me and others.
I'm rather intrigued that you seem to charge with refusing to accept what you consider here this site's main purpose, when I see so much obvious fabrications, false history and hate material under the guise of news, while you and others let all that stuff stay up on the newswire.
Not to mention that you (in the plural) don't touch posts in which anti-Zionists call others "ZioNazis" (of course neither side should use such slurs, but the anti-Zionists are primarily doing it).
I'm rather intrigued that you seem to charge with refusing to accept what you consider here this site's main purpose, when I see so much obvious fabrications, false history and hate material under the guise of news, while you and others let all that stuff stay up on the newswire.
Not to mention that you (in the plural) don't touch posts in which anti-Zionists call others "ZioNazis" (of course neither side should use such slurs, but the anti-Zionists are primarily doing it).
>you single me out and still I am charged with personalizing.
Tha was a different poster.
>Is that the reason why I am hated by billions?
You are hated by billions because you support ethnic supremacy in Palestine.
Tha was a different poster.
>Is that the reason why I am hated by billions?
You are hated by billions because you support ethnic supremacy in Palestine.
Which ethnic supremacy do you mean? And why in "Palestine"?
Jews should have more rights than non Jews in Palestine.
>Why Palestine?
Because that's where it's happening.
>Why Palestine?
Because that's where it's happening.
Which part of "Palestine"?
lies between the river and the sea. Israel is *part* of Palestine.
The First Terrorist People
By David Horowitz
FrontPageMagazine.com | January 26, 2006
The Palestinian Nazi Party has won the elections. This is a party, Hamas, that calls for the obliteration of the Jewish state (in so many words) and the killing of Jews because they are Jews (in so many words), and cites the Koranic damnation of Jews and incitement to murder Jews in justification. Hamas is a party of Islamic fanatics who are part of the global jihad against the United States and the West, whose hero is Osama bin Laden. Hamas was the biggest foreign supporter of Saddam Hussein. With this vote in record numbers, the Palestinian people have joined en masse the Axis of Evil. They are the self-declared enemies of Jews, of America and of civilized values, and should be treated as such. The Palestinians have declared with this vote they want no peace. They should be given none.
The defeated Fatah Party -- the "moderate" party -- is of course the creation of the terrorist Yassir Arafat. Its official charter calls for the destruction of Israel and its leadership has been dedicated to terror since the the PLO was created by the dictator Nasser and the KGB in 1964. Its leader Mahmoud Abbas is a Holocaust denier and the financier of the kidnapping and execution of the Israeli Olympic team in Munich in 1972, and Arafat's ally in terror for the duration since.
But then the father of Palestinian nationalism himself is the Grand Mufti of Jerusalem al-Husseini a fanatical devotee of Adolf Hitler who served the Nazi cause in Berlin during the Second World War and infused Palestinian nationalism with the Jew-hatred that has dominated it ever since.
The Palestinians are the first people in the history of humanity to embrace terror and genocide as a way of life. Palestinian schools train kindergarteners and first graders to aspire to murder innocent Jews by blowing themselves up alongside them, and then tell the children that if they're lucky enough to have male genitalia they will go to heaven and be rewarded with 72 virgins to attend their every whim. Palestinian parents murder their own children by telling them to kill Jewish children so that Allah can receive them. This is the sickest culture on the face of the earth, and the fact that it is supported by secular leftists in Europe and America reveals the terminal sickness, as well, of those who crusade in the name of "social justice."
At the core of this sickness is a hatred for the West and Israel for the crimes of being successful, democratic and tolerant. And at the core of that sickness is self-hatred. Self-hatred for the 1,000 year failure of Arab Muslim culture to compete with the West and for the absolute bankruptcy of the Palestinian cause -- despite billions and billions of dollars poured into the West Bank and Gaza by Europe, Israel and the United States whose sole purpose was to help this people consumed in their own emotional poisons. The money of course was stolen in transit by their corrupt and homicidal leaders who buried their loot in Swiss bank accounts or used it to buy weapons of mass murder, and to spread destruction, which is the only contribution that the Arabs of the Palestinian mandate have made to the world since their national aspirations were first announced half a century ago.
http://www.frontpagemag.com/Articles/Printable.asp?ID=21056
By David Horowitz
FrontPageMagazine.com | January 26, 2006
The Palestinian Nazi Party has won the elections. This is a party, Hamas, that calls for the obliteration of the Jewish state (in so many words) and the killing of Jews because they are Jews (in so many words), and cites the Koranic damnation of Jews and incitement to murder Jews in justification. Hamas is a party of Islamic fanatics who are part of the global jihad against the United States and the West, whose hero is Osama bin Laden. Hamas was the biggest foreign supporter of Saddam Hussein. With this vote in record numbers, the Palestinian people have joined en masse the Axis of Evil. They are the self-declared enemies of Jews, of America and of civilized values, and should be treated as such. The Palestinians have declared with this vote they want no peace. They should be given none.
The defeated Fatah Party -- the "moderate" party -- is of course the creation of the terrorist Yassir Arafat. Its official charter calls for the destruction of Israel and its leadership has been dedicated to terror since the the PLO was created by the dictator Nasser and the KGB in 1964. Its leader Mahmoud Abbas is a Holocaust denier and the financier of the kidnapping and execution of the Israeli Olympic team in Munich in 1972, and Arafat's ally in terror for the duration since.
But then the father of Palestinian nationalism himself is the Grand Mufti of Jerusalem al-Husseini a fanatical devotee of Adolf Hitler who served the Nazi cause in Berlin during the Second World War and infused Palestinian nationalism with the Jew-hatred that has dominated it ever since.
The Palestinians are the first people in the history of humanity to embrace terror and genocide as a way of life. Palestinian schools train kindergarteners and first graders to aspire to murder innocent Jews by blowing themselves up alongside them, and then tell the children that if they're lucky enough to have male genitalia they will go to heaven and be rewarded with 72 virgins to attend their every whim. Palestinian parents murder their own children by telling them to kill Jewish children so that Allah can receive them. This is the sickest culture on the face of the earth, and the fact that it is supported by secular leftists in Europe and America reveals the terminal sickness, as well, of those who crusade in the name of "social justice."
At the core of this sickness is a hatred for the West and Israel for the crimes of being successful, democratic and tolerant. And at the core of that sickness is self-hatred. Self-hatred for the 1,000 year failure of Arab Muslim culture to compete with the West and for the absolute bankruptcy of the Palestinian cause -- despite billions and billions of dollars poured into the West Bank and Gaza by Europe, Israel and the United States whose sole purpose was to help this people consumed in their own emotional poisons. The money of course was stolen in transit by their corrupt and homicidal leaders who buried their loot in Swiss bank accounts or used it to buy weapons of mass murder, and to spread destruction, which is the only contribution that the Arabs of the Palestinian mandate have made to the world since their national aspirations were first announced half a century ago.
http://www.frontpagemag.com/Articles/Printable.asp?ID=21056
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